Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 25 total)
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  • #11780
    Avatarwombat
    Participant

    I believe this has been around for a while but I only heard about it today and , I must say, I found it disturbing.
    I’m talking about the scoring app that enables golfers to enter their scores , hole by hole as they play, on their mobile phone.
    I cannot believe ANYONE is actually doing this. Surely it’s contrary to what most club golfers want and that’s to speed up the pace of play. All this is going to do is slow everything to a crawl. And, apparently, it can flatten your battery before you finish your round.
    I believe one Perth club is almost enforcing it on their members.
    Apologies if this has already been discussed, I did a search and couldn’t find anything.

    #11781
    MadamMadam
    Keymaster

    I believe this has been around for a while but I only heard about it today and , I must say, I found it disturbing.
    I’m talking about the scoring app that enables golfers to enter their scores , hole by hole as they play, on their mobile phone.
    I cannot believe ANYONE is actually doing this. Surely it’s contrary to what most club golfers want and that’s to speed up the pace of play. All this is going to do is slow everything to a crawl. And, apparently, it can flatten your battery before you finish your round.
    I believe one Perth club is almost enforcing it on their members.
    Apologies if this has already been discussed, I did a search and couldn’t find anything.

    There are a few around and with the Covid issues, many clubs have adopted the online scoring so scorecards dont have to be shared.

    Im not sure why its any different from a time perspective compared to a pencil and card? Fill out card then digital sign, put in GL# etc and ap, off to the pro shop.

    Re batter life Im unsure on that one. if its an APP that may be the case but some also use internet for the scoring part.

    Id love to hear feedback from users form around the country

    #11782
    Avatarwombat
    Participant

    I beg to differ on the time perspective.
    I’m pretty sure I could get my card out of my pocket and enter both my playing partners score and my own score before any mobile phone would actually open up , let alone have some one enter in a score. Most phones have some sort of security measure required before they open and then there’s the time taken for any app to open up. And then the scores need to be entered. Miclub app itself isn’t fast to open.
    Then you have a couple of weather issues. Too sunny and you’ve got to get the screen where you can see it. If it’s raining the phone needs to be in a waterproof section of your bag and then pulled out and opened up.
    Our captain is trying to get us to use this app and I know one lady member who has to carry a powerbank plugged into her phone because it was running her battery down to 10%.
    During the worst of the covid we were only allowed to mark our own cards. This has long gone and we’re now back to normal, marking our playing partners card. The only thing we don’t do now is run the card through the scanner in the pro shop.
    Call me old fashioned, but this is one piece of technology absolutely not needed on the golf course.

    #11783
    BarenskiBarenski
    Moderator

    I believe this has been around for a while but I only heard about it today and , I must say, I found it disturbing.
    I’m talking about the scoring app that enables golfers to enter their scores , hole by hole as they play, on their mobile phone.
    I cannot believe ANYONE is actually doing this. Surely it’s contrary to what most club golfers want and that’s to speed up the pace of play. All this is going to do is slow everything to a crawl. And, apparently, it can flatten your battery before you finish your round.
    I believe one Perth club is almost enforcing it on their members.
    Apologies if this has already been discussed, I did a search and couldn’t find anything.

    Club where I work is using the MiClub app…assuming that is what you are referring to…so that we (staff) don’t have to handle cards during the Covid situation. We are not enforcing it but highly recommending it.

    The feedback we got from members was very positive. The battery issue has surfaced but I believe you can turn off the GPS component and this makes it much more battery friendly.

    The part I like is that it really puts the onus on the member to put in their score…no entry means an NCR to golflink…not having to rely on the Proshop or another player to do it for them.

    I’m very much a traditionalist when it comes to golf..don’t use technology like GPS or rangefinders, prefer to use markers or my own judgement but I can see this being the way of the future for scoring in Competition golf.

    STILL FUCKING CAPTAIN
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    1 user liked this post.
    #11787
    Avatarjrg1166
    Participant

    Working in the IT industry consulting on Bussiness improvement and process improvement you may be the exception. The mode model for this including card processing at the end of the round indicates up to a 20% time saving across the board.

    Admittedly the majority of this is processing of TV e card at the end of thy e round removing manual entry etc. it also reduces the overhead on the pro shop in processing comps.

    I hate to say it but it will be the way of the future, digitalisation is coming to all walks of life and COVID has jus accelerated the process

    1 user liked this post.
    #11791
    MadamMadam
    Keymaster

    I beg to differ on the time perspective.
    I’m pretty sure I could get my card out of my pocket and enter both my playing partners score and my own score before any mobile phone would actually open up , let alone have some one enter in a score. Most phones have some sort of security measure required before they open and then there’s the time taken for any app to open up. And then the scores need to be entered. Miclub app itself isn’t fast to open.
    Then you have a couple of weather issues. Too sunny and you’ve got to get the screen where you can see it. If it’s raining the phone needs to be in a waterproof section of your bag and then pulled out and opened up.
    Our captain is trying to get us to use this app and I know one lady member who has to carry a powerbank plugged into her phone because it was running her battery down to 10%.
    During the worst of the covid we were only allowed to mark our own cards. This has long gone and we’re now back to normal, marking our playing partners card. The only thing we don’t do now is run the card through the scanner in the pro shop.
    Call me old fashioned, but this is one piece of technology absolutely not needed on the golf course.

    Our of interest. Do you still pay for things with cash I or mostly use a credit card?

    #11793
    Avatarwombat
    Participant

    I beg to differ on the time perspective.
    I’m pretty sure I could get my card out of my pocket and enter both my playing partners score and my own score before any mobile phone would actually open up , let alone have some one enter in a score. Most phones have some sort of security measure required before they open and then there’s the time taken for any app to open up. And then the scores need to be entered. Miclub app itself isn’t fast to open.
    Then you have a couple of weather issues. Too sunny and you’ve got to get the screen where you can see it. If it’s raining the phone needs to be in a waterproof section of your bag and then pulled out and opened up.
    Our captain is trying to get us to use this app and I know one lady member who has to carry a powerbank plugged into her phone because it was running her battery down to 10%.
    During the worst of the covid we were only allowed to mark our own cards. This has long gone and we’re now back to normal, marking our playing partners card. The only thing we don’t do now is run the card through the scanner in the pro shop.
    Call me old fashioned, but this is one piece of technology absolutely not needed on the golf course.

    Our of interest. Do you still pay for things with cash I or mostly use a credit card?

    Not sure of the relevance re paying cash.
    My argument is that this thing will take longer.
    Think about it…….you finish a hole, the bloke who’s card you’re marking tells you his score and you take out the card and enter 2 numbers (4 if you want to enter stableford points) and one dot or cross for the card reader. Done in about 10 seconds.
    With the phone you get the phone out, unlock it using one of several security systems, then scroll or swipe until you find the app, Tap the app….wait until it opens (this step alone will take longer than marking a scorecard with a pencil) and then enter a number when you find the appropriate section.
    Our current system you don’t even have to add up the score at the end of the round….if all the dots are there the card reader in the pro shop does it all….in the blink of an eye.
    The way of the future….nup…massive backward step. I can just see some of our older guys all standing around on a tee box trying to do this. Incidentally, many of our members don’t even take a phone to golf.

    #11796
    OldBogeyOldBogey
    Participant

    We use the miclub app at Warra, not compulsory. I take a card as well in case the electronics fail. We are still in the ‘mark your own card’ phase.

    Usage:
    Before you start your round, open the app and choose your scoring partner. 2-way, 3-way, two pairs all fine. No more complicated than working out whose card you’d otherwise take.
    After playing hole 1, pick up phone (touching the screen as you pick it up awakens the phone), tap the + sign in the top half (the player who you’re marking) once for each of his strokes (e.g 5 quick taps). Tap the plus sign in the bottom half for each of your strokes (5 quick taps). Check you’ve done it correctly, then swipe left and you’re on the next hole. Put the phone down & play the hole. Simples.
    On screen, it shows running scores, all the usual info for the current hole and gps to centre of green.
    On completion of the 18 holes, confirm scores with your marker. There’s provision for you to sign each other’s phone as confirmation, but as we are in ‘don’t fucking touch anything’ mode, just forge his sig. and swipe to submit the scores.
    At that point, it’s all done, go home.

    Issues:
    Time isn’t one. It’s quicker than writing the score on a card, checking on how many stab points to allot and no need to add anything up. No need to fill in dots in the autoscore area or to scan the card in and correct any errors.

    When you ‘submit’, it records the marker’s score but not yours in the system. If he’s a fuckwit and stuffs up your scores, submitting something wrong, you’ll need to sort it out in the pro shop. Similarly if his battery goes flat before the end of the round, your score hasn’t been submitted, but his score has gone in because you did it.

    It might be just my phone, but if wifi is turned on but not logged into a live connection, you get a beautifully explicit error message that says “Fore! Something has gone wrong”. Turn off wifi and it’s fine. If you had a wifi connection in the pro shop, you’ll get the same helpful message as soon as you’re out of range.

    You can check the live leaderboard for all players as you go round, including what hole they’re up to. So, when you’ve finished, check the leaderboard to make sure your score is in the system ok.

    I always run a manual score card as well, as insurance against a fuckwit marker.

    The app only handles stableford and stroke, for now. So no ‘par plus’ or other funnies.

    Overall, I think it’s good, but not perfect. The ‘no touchy feely’ aspect is very good.

    People say that nothing is impossible, but I do nothing every day.
    West Gippsland Veterans Champion 2017 & 2018
    Olinda Golf Club B Grade Champion 2018
    Warragul Country Club C Grade Champion 2019
    West Gippsland Veterans B Grade Champion 2019

    #11797
    Avatarwombat
    Participant

    We use the miclub app at Warra, not compulsory. I take a card as well in case the electronics fail. We are still in the ‘mark your own card’ phase.

    Usage:
    Before you start your round, open the app and choose your scoring partner. 2-way, 3-way, two pairs all fine. No more complicated than working out whose card you’d otherwise take.
    After playing hole 1, pick up phone (touching the screen as you pick it up awakens the phone), tap the + sign in the top half (the player who you’re marking) once for each of his strokes (e.g 5 quick taps). Tap the plus sign in the bottom half for each of your strokes (5 quick taps). Check you’ve done it correctly, then swipe left and you’re on the next hole. Put the phone down & play the hole. Simples.
    On screen, it shows running scores, all the usual info for the current hole and gps to centre of green.
    On completion of the 18 holes, confirm scores with your marker. There’s provision for you to sign each other’s phone as confirmation, but as we are in ‘don’t fucking touch anything’ mode, just forge his sig. and swipe to submit the scores.
    At that point, it’s all done, go home.

    Issues:
    Time isn’t one. It’s quicker than writing the score on a card, checking on how many stab points to allot and no need to add anything up. No need to fill in dots in the autoscore area or to scan the card in and correct any errors.

    When you ‘submit’, it records the marker’s score but not yours in the system. If he’s a fuckwit and stuffs up your scores, submitting something wrong, you’ll need to sort it out in the pro shop. Similarly if his battery goes flat before the end of the round, your score hasn’t been submitted, but his score has gone in because you did it.

    It might be just my phone, but if wifi is turned on but not logged into a live connection, you get a beautifully explicit error message that says “Fore! Something has gone wrong”. Turn off wifi and it’s fine. If you had a wifi connection in the pro shop, you’ll get the same helpful message as soon as you’re out of range.

    You can check the live leaderboard for all players as you go round, including what hole they’re up to. So, when you’ve finished, check the leaderboard to make sure your score is in the system ok.

    I always run a manual score card as well, as insurance against a fuckwit marker.

    The app only handles stableford and stroke, for now. So no ‘par plus’ or other funnies.

    Overall, I think it’s good, but not perfect. The ‘no touchy feely’ aspect is very good.

    Yikes….5 stabs for a 5. 10 for a 10….if you don’t lose count. And then a swipe. And I still stand by my comments re unlocking the phone before anything can be done.
    Sorry, much quicker to write 7 than 7 taps.
    With all due respect to your good self OB, there’s a lot of “ifs” in your post.
    And the fact that you’re still carrying a paper scorecard says it all.

    #11798
    MadamMadam
    Keymaster

    I beg to differ on the time perspective.
    I’m pretty sure I could get my card out of my pocket and enter both my playing partners score and my own score before any mobile phone would actually open up , let alone have some one enter in a score. Most phones have some sort of security measure required before they open and then there’s the time taken for any app to open up. And then the scores need to be entered. Miclub app itself isn’t fast to open.
    Then you have a couple of weather issues. Too sunny and you’ve got to get the screen where you can see it. If it’s raining the phone needs to be in a waterproof section of your bag and then pulled out and opened up.
    Our captain is trying to get us to use this app and I know one lady member who has to carry a powerbank plugged into her phone because it was running her battery down to 10%.
    During the worst of the covid we were only allowed to mark our own cards. This has long gone and we’re now back to normal, marking our playing partners card. The only thing we don’t do now is run the card through the scanner in the pro shop.
    Call me old fashioned, but this is one piece of technology absolutely not needed on the golf course.

    Our of interest. Do you still pay for things with cash I or mostly use a credit card?

    Not sure of the relevance re paying cash.
    My argument is that this thing will take longer.
    Think about it…….you finish a hole, the bloke who’s card you’re marking tells you his score and you take out the card and enter 2 numbers (4 if you want to enter stableford points) and one dot or cross for the card reader. Done in about 10 seconds.
    With the phone you get the phone out, unlock it using one of several security systems, then scroll or swipe until you find the app, Tap the app….wait until it opens (this step alone will take longer than marking a scorecard with a pencil) and then enter a number when you find the appropriate section.
    Our current system you don’t even have to add up the score at the end of the round….if all the dots are there the card reader in the pro shop does it all….in the blink of an eye.
    The way of the future….nup…massive backward step. I can just see some of our older guys all standing around on a tee box trying to do this. Incidentally, many of our members don’t even take a phone to golf.

    Takes longer to pay with cash, get change Etc than a tap of a credit card?

    We have moved into the modern world with this type of stuff. I can see the point your are trying to make but feel it’s minimal savings of time if any at all.

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 2 weeks ago by MadamMadam.
    #11800
    BumpunRunBumpunRun
    Participant

    Wombat, is there anything that anyone can say which you may accept any positives to this?

    1 user liked this post.
    #11810
    OldBogeyOldBogey
    Participant

    It seems that wombat may be a bit slow with some things.
    On leaving the pro shop, unlock phone, open app, goto scoring, choose partner, swipe to first hole. Yeah, that could take as much as 10 seconds. Then just leave the app open until you’ve finished, no further unlocking or anything, it’s just sitting there waiting for next input. I reckon I could do five taps in about 1 second, but let’s say 2. Including a swipe that’d be no more than 5 seconds to score the hole for both of you.

    With a card, how long does it take you to stuff it into your card holder, organise a pen or pencil and, if a completely manual system, write your name, ascertain your playing handicap and write that, add the date, etc?

    Yes, I take a card for insurance in case someone, or their phone, stuffs up. I waste another 5 seconds noting our scores, but haven’t needed it yet. It’s just a backup, which every good computer person does.

    As for using a card reader, I reckon I’m pretty good at putting the right dots on the right spots and the card I write usually goes straight through without a problem. Wait in the queue, scan the card, check the result, confirm and put the card in the box. If all goes well and no waiting, 15 seconds. But the crap I’ve had to sort out from incompetent others can take minutes. Still, that’s much more efficient than a fully manual system.

    With the phone app, it’s all done as soon as you walk away from the 18th green and you’re already on the leaderboard.

    But the app is not for everyone. I’m involved with the Vets. Some don’t have a mobile phone at all, many don’t have smart phones, many of those that do aren’t smart enough to use any apps, and that only leaves a few to use it. Then, you need to be playing at a Miclub course. In West Gippsland, Warragul is the only one and we have plenty of players who “can’t ” use the app. But for the rest of us, it’s good and it minimises the handling of the cards that someone has to do.

    People say that nothing is impossible, but I do nothing every day.
    West Gippsland Veterans Champion 2017 & 2018
    Olinda Golf Club B Grade Champion 2018
    Warragul Country Club C Grade Champion 2019
    West Gippsland Veterans B Grade Champion 2019

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 2 weeks ago by OldBogeyOldBogey.
    #11812
    Avatarwombat
    Participant

    It seems that wombat may be a bit slow with some things.
    On leaving the pro shop, unlock phone, open app, goto scoring, choose partner, swipe to first hole. Yeah, that could take as much as 10 seconds. Then just leave the app open until you’ve finished, no further unlocking or anything, it’s just sitting there waiting for next input. I reckon I could do five taps in about 1 second, but let’s say 2. Including a swipe that’d be no more than 5 seconds to score the hole for both of you.

    With a card, how long does it take you to stuff it into your card holder, organise a pen or pencil and, if a completely manual system, write your name, ascertain your playing handicap and write that, add the date, etc?

    Yes, I take a card for insurance in case someone, or their phone, stuffs up. I waste another 5 seconds noting our scores, but haven’t needed it yet. It’s just a backup, which every good computer person does.

    As for using a card reader, I reckon I’m pretty good at putting the right dots on the right spots and the card I write usually goes straight through without a problem. Wait in the queue, scan the card, check the result, confirm and put the card in the box. If all goes well and no waiting, 15 seconds. But the crap I’ve had to sort out from incompetent others can take minutes. Still, that’s much more efficient than a fully manual system.

    With the phone app, it’s all done as soon as you walk away from the 18th green and you’re already on the leaderboard.

    But the app is not for everyone. I’m involved with the Vets. Some don’t have a mobile phone at all, many don’t have smart phones, many of those that do aren’t smart enough to use any apps, and that only leaves a few to use it. Then, you need to be playing at a Miclub course. In West Gippsland, Warragul is the only one and we have plenty of players who “can’t ” use the app. But for the rest of us, it’s good and it minimises the handling of the cards that someone has to do.

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 2 weeks ago by OldBogeyOldBogey.

    And…here we go. Now you’re resorting to insults, that didn’t take long.
    It’s no wonder many people are no longer interested in contributing to a public forum.
    FYI, I’m pretty quick on the uptake on most things , and I doubt I’ve ever stuffed up a score card.
    Re your comments about a scorecard being slow because you have to “stuff it in your card holder” Back pocket for most blokes
    “Organise a pen or pencil”….not difficult at all.
    “Fill in the card”……most clubs print out the card at registration…with everything, even which holes you get shots on.
    In regard to opening the phone then the app. I don’t know what phone you use but mine automatically locks after a short period for security….so must be unlocked every time.
    And you’ve admitted yourself, your score input with this system is at the mercy of the bloke doing it, and if he/she stuffs it up it must be sorted at the pro shop.
    With the card reader you can see errors immediately and fix them with a tap.

    Anyway…my parting shot.
    Apart from a lot of golfers not having a smartphone or actually taking their phone out on the course, you have another problem where some (older) blokes have 2 pairs of glasses. My brother for one. He would have to change glasses simply to put his scores in the phone . He doesn’t need to do this with a handwritten card.
    No one I’ve spoken to in my club will be using this app.

    #11813
    Avatarjrg1166
    Participant

    Wombat,

    Just a couple of points to consider, o your Phone going to screen saver and you having to open it up every 5 minutes, that is dependent on the app, a number of golf apps now put the phone in always “Awake” when they are opened which will remove this issue. On the older golfers needing more than one pair glasses causing a problem. If they have a relative modern smart phone, last 5 years, they can “zoom” the screen using the finger expand process removing this need for multiple glasses. And if this is a problem if you use the accessibility option in settings you can zoom the screen permanently. I know this as we built an app for Guide Dogs Victoria which used this for the severely vision impaired.

    Also, I think you may want to consider the current situation which is probably last into the new year when a vaccine is available, the scoring app will help elevate social distancing constraints by not having to congregate in the pro shop to load the score card in. I understand that you are quick on the uptake on filling in the card and do not make mistakes but I am sure that you have been in the queue in the pro shop waiting for a member to enter the score as the reader did not load it properly or they made an error. The app speeds this up and removes these issues. It is not always about the individual benefit but about the collective benefit to the full field of players

    2 users liked this post.
    #11816
    Avatarwombat
    Participant

    Wombat,

    Just a couple of points to consider, o your Phone going to screen saver and you having to open it up every 5 minutes, that is dependent on the app, a number of golf apps now put the phone in always “Awake” when they are opened which will remove this issue. On the older golfers needing more than one pair glasses causing a problem. If they have a relative modern smart phone, last 5 years, they can “zoom” the screen using the finger expand process removing this need for multiple glasses. And if this is a problem if you use the accessibility option in settings you can zoom the screen permanently. I know this as we built an app for Guide Dogs Victoria which used this for the severely vision impaired.

    Also, I think you may want to consider the current situation which is probably last into the new year when a vaccine is available, the scoring app will help elevate social distancing constraints by not having to congregate in the pro shop to load the score card in. I understand that you are quick on the uptake on filling in the card and do not make mistakes but I am sure that you have been in the queue in the pro shop waiting for a member to enter the score as the reader did not load it properly or they made an error. The app speeds this up and removes these issues. It is not always about the individual benefit but about the collective benefit to the full field of players

    The queue in the pro shop is not a problem.
    The problem with this app will be the time it takes for the scores to entered after each hole.
    For the past few years golfers all over the world have been crying out for an improved pace of play. A few rule changes have been introduced, less time allowed to look for a lost ball, putting with the flagstick in .
    All I can see this scoring app doing is holding up play. Delays in the pro shop will always be there….we don’t want more holdups out on the course.
    Everyone I’ve spoken to has said exactly the same thing.
    I’m sure in 50 years time when all us oldies are dead and gone it will work…..but by then your ball will probably have transmitters to send the score straight to the pro shop computer when it hits the bottom of the hole.

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